Strange, but last night I submitted a posting on this subject and checking on my work computer its not there, so I'm re-posting it, but can't include the flight log, as I'm not on my home computer,  so I'll try and describe as best possible from memory.

I have been practising circuits for some time, and have done pretty well so far, and thought I'd try circuit mode.

My normal circuit practice was to take off, turn onto crosswind at 500', continue to 1000', turn immediately onto downwind, and IMMEDIATELY start to descend and reduce speed and lower flaps. When runway landing spot was in the centre of the screen in 45 degree over-the-shoulder view I turn onto base, set up for landing and that's it.

Tyring circuit mode, this is basically what happens:

1. Set up for take-off mode, then enter circuit mode.  No voice response but acknowledgement on top of screen.

2. Take off till 500'.  No instruction to turn to crosswind, but various comments about maintaining 1000' until base.

3. Continuing quite far out, then FSFS comments that I should be turning to crosswind at 500' - which I've already exceeded.  If I turn to crosswind at 500' before being reminded, I get no acknowledgement, but various messages about maintaining 1000' until base.

4. At 1000' on crosswind, no acknowledgement but various messages about taking off and that I should not be descending during take-off - FSFS has not recognized that I'm actually cruising.

5. No instruction to turn downwind.  If I turn downwind without instruction, FSFS loses all reference to circuits and treats this as an ordinary flight.

6. Eventually when pretty far out, FSFS reminds me that I should be turning downwind, which I do.

7. Continuing to base at 1000' I seem to pass the 45 degree reference point, which I recognize by rear 45 degree view of runway threshold in centre of screen.  I continually get messages that I should not be descending during take-off.

8. Eventually FSFS tells me to turn onto base.  I do this, and lower speed and reduce flaps.  FSFS doesn't recognize that I'm landing and continues to remind me that I should not lower flaps and descend during take-off.

9. FSFS tells me to turn to final, but I'm way off runway heading, but eventually manage to land visually.

I should also mention 2 other points that continually bother me.  The one is that no matter how well I fly or succeed in my score, I ALWAYS get the message that there is room for improvement, which is disconcering as I am doing quite well.  The other point is that on take-off, unless I rotate BEFORE the instructor tells me to do so, I get a criticism for rotating too late.  I am used to that now, but it is definitely an FSFS problem.  

Another thing I noticed in my circuits log was that it mentioned problems during taxiing - but there was not taxiing.  I started off at threshold and immediately went into take-off mode.

I hope I've been clear about all this.  Something to think about.  Otherwise, still an excellent product and I'm very happy with it.

Have a good weekend everybody.

Stan

Regards
Ole Andreasen, Denmark

Thanks Ole.  I'm still sneaking in some time at the office to read my mail but I'll try it over the weekend and post my results.

The two points I mentioned about rotating before instructed, and the "room for improvement" message, are still an issue, but I can live with that.

Cheers

Stan

Regards
Ole Andreasen, Denmark

Cheers

Stan

Regards
Ole Andreasen, Denmark

Been unable to get to all the posts - trying to catch up...

The key point here is that FSFS in general will analyze what you are doing and let you know if something is a problem. It does this in over 100 key areas of airmanship and generally good pilot habits.

The role of the core product, starting with FSFS Classic, is to let you know what you need to improve on. It is not a set of lessons and it does not tell you what to do from scratch. You need to know the basics of how to get airborne first.

One of the reasons we did this is that since at least 2002, FS has come with detailed flying lessons of its own. The missions system of FSX adds even more.

Unlike the lessons, which at set locations in specific aircraft, our goal was to provide an instructor who you could take anywhere in any plane and still keep an eye on you.

With FSFS2009, we added "warning" logic to the instructor's minds. In a great number of cases, the instructor will tell you about something which is becoming a problem but before deducting points for it. If you ignore the warning, or just can't do it right because you need more practice, then you will indeed lose some points.

Finally, in later versions of FSFS2009 and in FSFS2010 we have added a lot of helpful hints that will give you cues of what to do even though there is no problem at all.

In addition to this, the Detail Packs (we are working on more...), of which there is presently just the Cessna 172, add a great deal of help and hints that are totally specific to the airplane dealt with by the detail pack.

Moving on - Circuits are by far the hardest thing to achieve a good score at in FSFS. Yeah- I know - "Circuits are not so tough!" in the real world, but in the FSFS world, this is the one time when your instructor knows exactly how he or she wants you to fly the entire flight.

As a result, the instructor is watching you much closer than when you are flying in general.

During circuits you must continue to tell the instructor what you are doing by advancing the flight mode at the right times. Note that the instructor is not telling you when to do things - he is advising you if you are late in doing something.

Note also that, as the instructor says, you fly your downwind leg at a constant altitude.

I hope this helps.

Jeff Preston ('Squadron Leader') - FSFlyingSchool Publisher & Lead Developer


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Thanks for the clear explanation of the thinking behind FSFS.  This makes it much clearer than to simply state that FSFS has been proven by thousands of satisfied customers and I keep blaming FSFS for my inadequacies.  That is not the way to encourage support for this truly excellent product.  I truly and honestly did not understand the fact that, for instance, when the instructor said "Ready to rotate" followed by "OK, rotate", he was actually reminding me that I should have done this already, and was NOT giving me instructions to follow.  I also did not now that when flying circuits, you have to still fly the plane as in normal mode, and the circuit mode is simply an EVALUATION of your performance in accordance with the parameters of the design.  This was NOT a criticism of FSFS but merely an observation, and I get the feeling that some folks are overly sensitive to such observations as being a criticism of FSFS. 

So, having said my little piece, let me say the following for the benefit of anybody who wishes to buy this remarkable product.

1. It IS a remarkable product, which might irritate you at times, but in the course of this irritation will improve your flying skills 1000%.  There is no equivalent product on the market.  It has been very well thought out, and the fact that it really doesn't seem to have any bugs speaks for the care and talent of the design team.  The only problem I have experienced is my misunderstanding of certain features - and maybe these issues could be spelled out more clearly in future descriptions for dumb aviators like me.

2. It offers a very realistic environment, which is MUCH more practical than the check rides within FSFS.

3. I have bought ALL the addons, the latest being the sound pack, and will continue to support FSFS when you issue additional addons.

4. I intend using FSFS in my flying school workshop for the kids in a special school for talented kids, (as we have discussed previously), as I believe it will provide inspiration and practical guidance in a fun and instructive way.  If my workshop is successful, I will without a doubt want to uses FSFS in further workshops on a basis which we can discuss.

5. I will continue posting any comments which I construe as either problematic to me or positively constructive.

And just one teeny question - in the sound pack, when I ask the instructor to "Be quiet please", he continues talking, and the only way I can keep him quiet is to tell him that I want to fly myself.  Any advice on this one?

Keep up the excellent work.

Stan

Stan.

The beginning of your post above, was directly written to me. So even if you write "Squadron leader" I´ll butt in. Allow me please.

I owe you an apology. It is a case of believing that if something is obvious to you - you also think its obvious to everyone else. AND that is not the case - by a long shot.

I thought I had made it clear in the posts above how the system works, but if you were still in doubt, then my teaching skills lack, and I got - unpleasent! For this Im sorry.

I hope you will continue to listen to my advise here and there, and I shall try to be clearer in my posts.

In the case of "be quiet please": Does is never work? I have no problems with the phrase. Do you have problems with other phrases? Have you done the practicing of the speech program? Its imperative that you do the practice sessions to have the speech program know your unique way of speaking.

I had a LOT of problems to begin with - so many that I wanted to give up on it, but SL showed me the way, and now - after going through the practice sessions, my voice recognition captures every phrase without problems.

- and hey - the practice sessions are actually fun to do - in my opinion!

Ole

Regards
Ole Andreasen, Denmark

Apology accepted completely and totally.  Hey, we all get carried away sometimes - I know I get over-enthusiastic sometimes and start bugging everybody with questions.  BUT THE IMPORTANT THING is that we, in the flightsim fraternity, are a close-knit bunch, working in the interests of our great hobby, and trying to make it more fun and instructive for all of us.  So, that matter is closed.

On the "Be quite please" issue - this seems to be the only phrase that Smithy doesn't understand.  When I tell him I want to fly alone, he remains quiet.  But I think that "Be quiet please" operates slightly differently.  As the instructions say, you may have to wait for him to finish a phrase before he reacts.  So my question there is, what actually happens when you use this phrase?  Does he finish saying what he is saying and then remain quiet until you ask for help, or am I maybe saying something that re-activates him?  The voice recognition works perfectly otherwise.

I repeat - FSFS has improved my flying skills immeasurably and I can't wait for the next update.  I'm currently flying circuits, but they can be tricky.  For instance, I just achieved an 80 for a Cessna circuit, which I was proud of, but, in my concentration, only got a 69 for my landing, so I couldn't post it.  On other occasions I have achieved high landing scores and just missed the circuit score.  DARN!  But we keep trying.

Take care, and I always appreciate your advice.  I'm hoping that if my FS school which I'm going to present at the school for gifted children is a success, I will be able to promote FSFS even more.  But I think they only want me in September.  If there is any way I can assist to promote FSFS, I'd love to do so.

Stan